Comments on: Jump Starting The Teshuva Batteries http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/ Baalei Teshuva / Baalei Teshuvah and Other Growth Oriented Jews Fri, 30 Jul 2010 01:49:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Steve Brizel http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-379827 Steve Brizel Sun, 30 Aug 2009 13:54:27 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-379827 Ron Coleman wrote the following in response to my query: "Steve, if you change your tzitzis from the ones you put on in the morning (and which were exempted by the brocha on the Talis Gadol), of course (I think!) you say a new brocha. This is also the case if you took them off and did not have an intention to put them back on, fell asleep, tarried too long, etc. I think in this case I was changing into the Shabbos Talis Katan for that extra-thick-string charge — better conductivity, after all!" WADR, can you quote me a Mesorah of such a Psak or a Posek who actually has ruled in that manner? Ron Coleman wrote the following in response to my query:
“Steve, if you change your tzitzis from the ones you put on in the morning (and which were exempted by the brocha on the Talis Gadol), of course (I think!) you say a new brocha. This is also the case if you took them off and did not have an intention to put them back on, fell asleep, tarried too long, etc.

I think in this case I was changing into the Shabbos Talis Katan for that extra-thick-string charge — better conductivity, after all!”

WADR, can you quote me a Mesorah of such a Psak or a Posek who actually has ruled in that manner?

]]> By: Neil Harris http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-379014 Neil Harris Fri, 28 Aug 2009 03:57:59 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-379014 I hope it was good two years. I hope it was good two years.

]]> By: Ron Coleman http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378965 Ron Coleman Thu, 27 Aug 2009 22:06:19 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378965 Thanks, Neil. I don't have an articulate answer to your question. I hadn't even remembered the post until Mark told me it was going up in reruns (from the title I thought it was another, really bad post I didn't want to see again!) I can't even believe it's been two years since then. Thanks, Neil.

I don’t have an articulate answer to your question. I hadn’t even remembered the post until Mark told me it was going up in reruns (from the title I thought it was another, really bad post I didn’t want to see again!) I can’t even believe it’s been two years since then.

]]> By: Neil Harris http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378927 Neil Harris Thu, 27 Aug 2009 17:59:59 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378927 Great post, Ron. I'm curious, how do you feel now (two years later) reading this? I know that I constantly feel a need for a jump start (oddly my car engine just caught fire and died two days ago, I'm sure there's a message in that for me). Great post, Ron. I’m curious, how do you feel now (two years later) reading this? I know that I constantly feel a need for a jump start (oddly my car engine just caught fire and died two days ago, I’m sure there’s a message in that for me).

]]> By: Ron Coleman http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378926 Ron Coleman Thu, 27 Aug 2009 17:56:28 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378926 Steve, if you change your tzitzis from the ones you put on in the morning (and which were exempted by the brocha on the Talis Gadol), of course (I think!) you say a new brocha. This is also the case if you took them off and did not have an intention to put them back on, fell asleep, tarried too long, etc. I think in this case I was changing into the Shabbos Talis Katan for that extra-thick-string charge -- better conductivity, after all! Steve, if you change your tzitzis from the ones you put on in the morning (and which were exempted by the brocha on the Talis Gadol), of course (I think!) you say a new brocha. This is also the case if you took them off and did not have an intention to put them back on, fell asleep, tarried too long, etc.

I think in this case I was changing into the Shabbos Talis Katan for that extra-thick-string charge — better conductivity, after all!

]]> By: Steve Brizel http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378918 Steve Brizel Thu, 27 Aug 2009 16:53:32 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378918 Ron-just curious-if one is married, IIRC, the only bracha is on a Talis Gadol, as opposed to a Talis Katan. Is there any Mesorah or accepted Psak that a new Talid Katan for a married man entails any bracha other than possibly a Shecheyanu? I also remember purchasing my first pair of Tzitis at an NCSY National Convention, beginning to wear them at home and to public school. Wearing Tzitis , davening three time a day, keeping Shabbos and Kashrus were all major milestones in my own trajectory. Ron-just curious-if one is married, IIRC, the only bracha is on a Talis Gadol, as opposed to a Talis Katan. Is there any Mesorah or accepted Psak that a new Talid Katan for a married man entails any bracha other than possibly a Shecheyanu?

I also remember purchasing my first pair of Tzitis at an NCSY National Convention, beginning to wear them at home and to public school. Wearing Tzitis , davening three time a day, keeping Shabbos and Kashrus were all major milestones in my own trajectory.

]]> By: Bob Miller http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378912 Bob Miller Thu, 27 Aug 2009 15:02:03 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378912 This easy-to-follow but profound book has a lot of info relevant to the above comments: http://www.feldheim.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?item=978-159826-227-8 This easy-to-follow but profound book has a lot of info relevant to the above comments:
http://www.feldheim.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?item=978-159826-227-8

]]> By: Mark Frankel http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378905 Mark Frankel Thu, 27 Aug 2009 12:59:31 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378905 It's a machlokes (difference of opinion) between the Rambam (Hashem set nature in motion at creation) and Ramban (Hashem is continuously behind the natural process). Here's a <a href="http://yediah.blogspot.com/2007/01/miracles-ramban-and-rambam-two-opposing.html" rel="nofollow">decent article</a> to start with, but as you investigate the subject, you'll find discussion on what is the view of each proponent. In my experience, and from what others have taught me, the hashkafah of the Modern Orthodox world lines up more often behind the Rambam while the Yeshivish world is more in line with the Ramban on these issues. It’s a machlokes (difference of opinion) between the Rambam (Hashem set nature in motion at creation) and Ramban (Hashem is continuously behind the natural process). Here’s a decent article to start with, but as you investigate the subject, you’ll find discussion on what is the view of each proponent.

In my experience, and from what others have taught me, the hashkafah of the Modern Orthodox world lines up more often behind the Rambam while the Yeshivish world is more in line with the Ramban on these issues.

]]> By: Unsure http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-378904 Unsure Thu, 27 Aug 2009 12:49:13 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-378904 I was always under the impression that the appropriate metaphor for God's creation was a battery-powered device, not something plugged in to an electric circuit. My rabbis always taught me that the view of the Rishonim -- ha-olam k-minhago noheig -- that the world operates according to fixed rules -- meant that God created the universe and was involved in it via Divine providence for certain meritorious individuals, but that most of us and most of creation were subjected to the rules of nature and our instantaneous existence was in no way miraculous or a constant "effort" on God's part (what I think you refer to as "continuing generation") . I am curious why so much of what I read on the internet tends to disagree with this view, which again was articulated to me by very mainstream Orthodox rabbis. Do most people really believe in a "continuous involvement" by God? Or do they believe that God only enters the picture on behalf of certain tzadikim (providence) or on certain temporary occasions (miracles)? I was always under the impression that the appropriate metaphor for God’s creation was a battery-powered device, not something plugged in to an electric circuit. My rabbis always taught me that the view of the Rishonim — ha-olam k-minhago noheig — that the world operates according to fixed rules — meant that God created the universe and was involved in it via Divine providence for certain meritorious individuals, but that most of us and most of creation were subjected to the rules of nature and our instantaneous existence was in no way miraculous or a constant “effort” on God’s part (what I think you refer to as “continuing generation”) .

I am curious why so much of what I read on the internet tends to disagree with this view, which again was articulated to me by very mainstream Orthodox rabbis. Do most people really believe in a “continuous involvement” by God? Or do they believe that God only enters the picture on behalf of certain tzadikim (providence) or on certain temporary occasions (miracles)?

]]> By: Ron Coleman http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-91053 Ron Coleman Thu, 23 Aug 2007 19:58:41 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-91053 Thank you, MG, and Bob. Thank you, MG, and Bob.

]]> By: MG http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-91015 MG Thu, 23 Aug 2007 16:14:37 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-91015 Well said! This is a great piece. I would be interested in also hearing the female perspective. Ladies, what is your "battery pack"? I wonder if mine is my siddur...If so, it definitely needs to be recharged. Well said!
This is a great piece. I would be interested in also hearing the female perspective. Ladies, what is your “battery pack”?

I wonder if mine is my siddur…If so, it definitely needs to be recharged.

]]> By: Jaded Topaz http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-90890 Jaded Topaz Wed, 22 Aug 2007 17:46:04 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-90890 So speaking of recharging battery packs, just yesterday I found myself in barnes n noble unintentionally part of a poetry reading loving audience redirected from bryant park's reading room corner due to the incessent rain, listening to newly appointed U.S. Poet Laureate, Charles Simic. As I listened along with the captured and enraptured audience and took out my camera to photograph this noble poet my camera flashed "change battery pack". Having just charged the thing, I knew it was mixed signals the camera was tryin to confuse me with. I fiddled around with battery changed its position a few times and then she was good to go, having given up blinking messages and excuses why she can't function and photograph. The euphoric spiritual scent of new fringe garments aside, sometimes changing positions and perspectives is all one really needs to be able to photograph life in 8.1 megapixel crystal clear clarity again. I'm not so sure that's its the fringe benefit of fringe garment purchases or other judaica decor that's necessarily needed for picture perfect spiritual living and loving. Though I am sure that judaica stores across america strongly suggest and feel otherwise. Walking through the garment district in the morning and taking in the sequins and sparkle material offerings in the windows gives me the same spiritual oh my gd I'm so lucky to be alive and thank you gd for creating sequins glitter and sparkle in the windows for merry morning musing before work thing. Its perspective mostly. So speaking of recharging battery packs, just yesterday I found myself in barnes n noble unintentionally part of a poetry reading loving audience redirected from bryant park’s reading room corner due to the incessent rain, listening to newly appointed U.S. Poet Laureate, Charles Simic. As I listened along with the captured and enraptured audience and took out my camera to photograph this noble poet my camera flashed “change battery pack”.
Having just charged the thing, I knew it was mixed signals the camera was tryin to confuse me with.
I fiddled around with battery changed its position a few times and then she was good to go, having given up blinking messages and excuses why she can’t function and photograph.

The euphoric spiritual scent of new fringe garments aside, sometimes changing positions and perspectives is all one really needs to be able to photograph life in 8.1 megapixel crystal clear clarity again.
I’m not so sure that’s its the fringe benefit of fringe garment purchases or other judaica decor that’s necessarily needed for picture perfect spiritual living and loving. Though I am sure that judaica stores across america strongly suggest and feel otherwise.

Walking through the garment district in the morning and taking in the sequins and sparkle material offerings in the windows gives me the same spiritual oh my gd I’m so lucky to be alive and thank you gd for creating sequins glitter and sparkle in the windows for merry morning musing before work thing.

Its perspective mostly.

]]> By: Martin Fleischer http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-90876 Martin Fleischer Wed, 22 Aug 2007 13:52:34 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-90876 Ron, For me, that feeling came last year. I eventually bought a 2nd one, and my feeling was this: "What took me so long?" Marty Ron,

For me, that feeling came last year. I eventually bought a 2nd one, and my feeling was this: “What took me so long?”

Marty

]]> By: Steve Brizel http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-90872 Steve Brizel Wed, 22 Aug 2007 13:31:22 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-90872 I picked up a very interesting sefer that was published by the Talmidim of R Wolbe ZTL entitled "HaMitzvos HaShekulos" which seems to be a series of Mussar Shmussen on a number of mitzvos that are considered to be very important in a sense that they are "shakul kneged Kol HaTorah". AZ, Shabbos, Torah, Bris Milah,and EY are a few of the Mitvos which R Wolbe ZTL discusses therein. I picked up a very interesting sefer that was published by the Talmidim of R Wolbe ZTL entitled “HaMitzvos HaShekulos” which seems to be a series of Mussar Shmussen on a number of mitzvos that are considered to be very important in a sense that they are “shakul kneged Kol HaTorah”. AZ, Shabbos, Torah, Bris Milah,and EY are a few of the Mitvos which R Wolbe ZTL discusses therein.

]]> By: Bob Miller http://www.beyondbt.com/2009/08/27/jump-starting-the-teshuva-batteries/comment-page-1/#comment-90860 Bob Miller Wed, 22 Aug 2007 12:36:02 +0000 http://www.beyondbt.com/?p=796#comment-90860 Bravo! Bravo!

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